On Time

65

By Teresa McGurk

photo credit: from the free photo stock at morguefile.com
photo credit: from the free photo stock at morguefile.com

The time paradox

One of my favorite episodes of the TV series Lost is Season Five's "Whatever Happened, Happened," because it contains the following conversation between Hurley and Miles, who have found themselves thirty years in the past:

  • Miles Straume: Any of us can die because this is our present.

    Hugo 'Hurley' Reyes: But you said Ben couldn't die because he still has to grow up and become the leader of the Others.

    Miles Straume: Because this is his past.

    Hugo 'Hurley' Reyes: When we first captured Ben and Sayid just tortured him, then why wouldn't he remember getting shot by that same guy when he was a kid.

    Miles Straume: Huh... I hadn't thought of that.

If you followed the intricacies of that particular show, you'll know just how exasperating that conversation must be for Miles, and how funny it is for the audience. The point is that no one ever quite knows how to handle the time paradox in science fiction. The basic theories are these:

  • time is progressive and immutable -- we cannot change the past
  • time is fluid and past events may be altered, elaborated on, or avoided
  • time has its own "gravity" (for want of a better word) that pulls it towards a certain series of events, although there may be variations or substitutions in the details
  • time is random (think of disk RAM) and all events are at any time perhaps simultaneous or folded in time to be near each other (like two edges of a sheet of paper folded over)
  • all time and all possibilities exist and coexist in parallel streams or tributaries of time that may or may not overlap

The most famous paradox concerning time travel is the "grandfather" or grandmother paradox: what if you went to the past and by some means altered a sequence of events that led to you not being born? Would you immediately disappear? Would you be born elsewhere, to other parents, and be consequently much different (in terms of upbringing and genetic disposition)? Furthermore, if you did disappear, would that mean you would not have been able to go into the past in the first place, so whatever event you had triggered that had prevented you being born would not have happened, so you would have been born after all, and if you then went back in time. . .

Time travel is a tricky gig. It has fascinated me ever since I learned that Dr. Who was a Time Lord, sometime in 1963. The idea that a traveler could observe past or future events, and influence their outcome, was intriguing. Even more problematic, however, would be to observe events but not take part or influence them in any way. That possibility seems reasonable at first glance. But then, what if the act of observing or being observed changed someone's behavior? Light, traveling, is either detected to be a particle or a wave, depending on the moment of observation. What if time is a similar construct, and the very act of observation can influence events? In order to be completely safe, the traveler would have to exist outside of time, outside of the moment being observed, and therefore invisible to everyone present.

One thing we do know

One aspect of time we can all agree on (except, of course, for Benjamin Button) is that we perceive it to flow in one direction only: we are born, we grow up, we die. The issue to understand in that sentence is that it depends on our perception. If we acknowledge that our lives follow a linear progression of perceived events, then it would not necessarily matter what year we were in: the moment we would be experiencing would be our "present moment of perception," and that's what Miles is saying in his conversation above with Hurley.

Hurley responds with the "grandfather paradox," however, saying that if someone else's travel to the past impinged upon our existence there, we would remember it--i.e. that there would be no "first run" of events when the time traveler was not there. Both views depend on our perception: the past is either already over and immutable (you would remember the time traveler from your past experience); or someone can go back and be in a past moment for the first time at a later date; an outside observer would notice that there was a change: that events already finished and over (Act I) were changed in another version of that timeline (Act II) -- like some kind of interminable play by Samuel Beckett.

This would suggest that there is no such thing as one time-line. It would suggest that time is constantly forking into myriad directions, and our perceptions of it constitute each individual stream of events as perceived by us and the people around us. Think of Jorge Luis Borges's "Garden of the Forking Paths" for a moment, and you will have a clear understanding of how future events can branch out into multifarious possibilities, streaming and forking from a present point that is not fixed, but that is consequent to a previous forking or branching of possibilities in the past.

It would mean that each individual is responsible for the forking paths of his life (don't mention Frost, please), not only responsible for his own being, but also for streaming future events like light streaming through a prism but only following one perceived route in the possible spectrum available to him (we can only handle one perception of our surroundings and the present; we couldn't handle concurrent timelines in which events are seen to turn out in several different ways all at once).

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Keith S profile image

Keith S 2 years ago

Teresa,

I have been meaning to ask you. What time is it?

shibashake profile image

shibashake Level 5 Commenter 2 years ago

What an interesting topic of discussion.

I really liked the way Babylon 5 dealt with time-traveling. They really tried to be very consistent about it, and I think they did a really good job.

I also started thinking about prescience. Prescience could just be our sub-conscious brain's ability to process all the information around us in a different way than our conscious brain. It then provides flashes of possible futures for us. In a way that is a type of time traveling.

Some of us also time travel by choosing the things we remember and how we remember them. All very interesting stuff!

Pete Maida profile image

Pete Maida Level 1 Commenter 2 years ago

That is fanscinating stuff. I can't imagine the one could change history and be aware of it. Either there is one timeline and whatever happens instantly becomes the reality or there are many timelines and you just switch the the proper one.

Azimov's End of Enternity a great time story. I also liked how it was handled in the movie Frequency. By the way you're doing a darn good job yourself.

Teresa McGurk profile image

Teresa McGurk Hub Author 2 years ago

Keith -- thanks for asking -- I've just noticed what time it is. Time for a cuppa.

Shibashake -- yes, I thought Babylon 5 had great writing and great sensitivity to time issues. Pity some of the hairstyles were so bad. Actually, don't get me started on B5, as it dealt with so many real issues with real intelligence, from diplomatic relations to alcoholism to personal responsibility. Thanks for your great comment.

Pete -- Haven't read End of Eternity -- I will do, though, now! Thanks for the tip. Frequency? Not sure I know that one, will look for it. . . Oh, and thanks for the compliment. I have myself so tied up in temporal knots, though, that I don't know which way to turn next.

Duchess OBlunt profile image

Duchess OBlunt Level 4 Commenter 2 years ago

Great reading Teresa, a topic that has always sparked an interest, but my brain just spins when I try to figure any of it out. I do enjoy watching movies that deal with the theme. I LOVED Frequency. Have not read End of Eternity either, but think I shall make a visit to the bookstore.

Teresa McGurk profile image

Teresa McGurk Hub Author 2 years ago

Thanks for mentioning Frequency again, I'll certainly check it out. And thanks for stopping by, Duchess!

Queen of the Lint profile image

Queen of the Lint 2 years ago

Speaking of time travel - I've almost got my time machine finished. Just need one more part. Anyone got a spare quantum emulator out there?

Teresa McGurk profile image

Teresa McGurk Hub Author 2 years ago

mine's in the wash, but would a sonic screwdriver be any use? Thanks for coming by.

Nemingha profile image

Nemingha 2 years ago

Lost lost me as a viewer after only a few episodes, so thankfully I was spared this inane conversation. As for pondering time itself, well I find that a lot like pondering space -- vast and without end or limits. Definitely not a good subject for my limited cranial capacity! Like the way you have handled it though.

Paradise7 profile image

Paradise7 Level 7 Commenter 2 years ago

This one's gonna haunt me for a week. Thank you, I think. Talk about a brain-bender. I don't think I've heard anyone else lay out the possibilities and paradoxes quite so articulately.

opinion duck 2 years ago

Pete

I really haven't heard of any persuasive theories to warrant a believe that time can be traveled.

The space time continuum is based on gravitational distortions, a major example of which is the black hole. Where everything in physics that we know of, disappears.

It makes more sense to think of time as a monitor function and not a variable. Equations do use time as a variable but it is the unknown to solve or the constant to add to the equation. Currently, there is a lot of change in the thinking among scientists about quantum physics and its theories. Even some on things that go faster than the speed of light.

Still, these are just theories at this point.

Your example of folding a piece of paper, may be valid for a static condition but not for time which is a dynamic.

For time to be traversed, especially into the past, matter and its states would have to somehow be stored for retrieval. I know of no such mechanism that exists.

Just imagine all of the events that occur in the universe in just one second. Using Plank's constant of 10 to the minus 44th power as the interval timer to store changes that would be an enormous storage task. It would be 10 to the 44th power of events that take place in just one second.

The time that I am discussing is not the hour, minute, second that we use to tell time, it is based on the fastest any event can happen. If Plank's constant is that time, then that is how even the fastest subatomic particle can change.

My point is that to traverse time, you have to be able to reconstruct these events to where they were at that past time. As for going to the future, it can only be conceived of if we are not in the present. Because, by my definition the future doesn't exist.

It would be interesting, if we could determine whether we are in a present time domain or a relative time domain to an absolute universe time.

If you believe that there is a future time that has already happened right now, then you could also consider that the Universe has ended and it is just a matter of time for it to show some signs.

When they talk about portals (the folding paper points) to take shortcuts in the universe, this is not time travel to me. It may involve time but the destination is not time in our world.

Anyway, thanks for the opportunity to comment on one of my favorite topics.

BTW, I have read about the different theories about time, including some of the most recent ones, and yet they don't answer my questions on time.

Thanks

Elena. profile image

Elena. Level 1 Commenter 2 years ago

Teresa, this was great! I always found time theory fascinating, and more than the past I've always been tickled by the concept of future, which I think is a mental fabrication based on conventional wisdom. We believe it's coming because we have a past to base that knowledge on, but in truth we dont know s**t :-) If we think of the laws of physics, then there is empiric proof to be had that the future arrives, but it can only be proved once it's here, in the present. Oh my. I just LOVE this topic!

shamelabboush profile image

shamelabboush Level 1 Commenter 2 years ago

This is really tricky subject! I ws reading and my head was spinning.... Great hub..

Teresa McGurk profile image

Teresa McGurk Hub Author 2 years ago

Nemingha -- it is endlessly fascinating, though, isn't it? Thanks for coming by.

Paradise7 -- I'm afraid I have a very limited understanding of the physics involved, and can only scratch the surface, so thanks for reading and commenting.

Opinion Duck -- indeed. Recreating a past moment would involve the manipulation of too many variables to be possible; that is, however, approaching the idea from the physical "outside" and considering time to be a motion regular in function both forward and backward. The "folding paper" idea is a crude manner of understanding how dimensional space and time might be approached as possibly capable of intersecting in ways we are not familiar with. But it's so much easier to think of the universe in Newtonian terms of mechanical predictability. Time for another cuppa, I think. Thank you for contributing to the topic so thoroughly. I'd love to hear more.

Elena, of course there is a future, and it all has been brewed up in a big pot at the Guinness breweries in Dublin, the source of all future happenings in the universe, the wellspring of our being, the motherlode of our origins. Slainte!

Shamelabboush -- thanks for commenting. I have no idea what I was talking about, but it fascinates me that there are so many different ways people perceive the subject to be debatable, most of them (i.e. mind) outside of the realm of fact.

Suiiki profile image

Suiiki 2 years ago

A good introduction to the folding paper idea is Madeline L'Engle's A Wrinkle In Time. It's a children's novel, but it's the kind you can read as an adult and take an entirely new perspective from it. I've read it multiple times since I was 8 or so years old, and each time I've learned something new.

But then again, my first experience with time travel was crawling into bed with mum and dad when I was about three to watch a certain Time Lord...so I'm probably not a normal person when it comes to these things.

Cris A profile image

Cris A 2 years ago

Teresa

Philosophical analyses or even musings bore me as I tend to get lost in the jargons BUT your greatest gift, in my humble opinion, is your ability to entertain. Needless to say, I wouldn't mind being time warped somewhere in the past or future just as long as you're there with your "stories".

Btw, I gave up on Lost after the second season. Watching the events unfold was like grasping at straws - i don't like feeling helpless like that :D

Iphigenia 2 years ago

Backward watches and wall clocks and a pocket stop watch like the white rabbit plus my pet time thieves all serve to add nothing to this discussion .... fascinating as it has been until I stuck my oar in ... but I can't think properly with waterlogged feet.

tonymac04 profile image

tonymac04 2 years ago

Time is a thief...time is the only resource shared equally...time is linear....time is cyclical..time is rhythm. Ah, now that I can relate to! I don't know about elsewhere but here in South Africa the past and the future are always present and our ends and our beginning frequently become one.

Especially if its got a drum beat going!

Loved this discussion of time - serious and funny at the same time, rather like time itself which seems to me to be always unfolding and flodsing (folding - wish they had a goddam spellchecker in the comments module!) in on itself rather like a Moebius strip which has no beginning and no end.

So what was the time, did you say?

Thanks for this great (as alwys from you!) Hub

Love and peace (in all time)

Tony

opinion duck 2 years ago

Although, I don't believe time can be traveled, it would be interesting to wonder what limits there would be to that travel?

If we are not in the absolute present time, then you could seemingly go forward in time to the absolute present. Going any further than absolute present time has no meaning.

If we can go backward in time, then how far back could we go?

Back to 0 AD or further to the Garden of Eden or even before that time.

How about going back to the Big Bang?

Remember going back in time is not teleportation, you would still be in the same physical space you started from.

If you could only travel in time by moving say faster than light, then you would not be in your time and space.

Unless the universe is built like the video game Sim City, there is no real expectation of time travel. Even if there was, don't we make the worse of the time we live in?

Here is what I think another interesting thought.

Because of the time it takes light to travel through the universe, isn't it possible that the universe, at least the outer portions of it, are already dead or gone.

How would we know?

Thanks for allowing me to comment here.

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